Allegro Club International

[Colin T]

I have made the two wiring looms needed to wire up front foglamps on S3 cars, thanks to information provided by Andy Mallett.

However, I have some questions if anybody can help:

1. Is the relay used the same standard relay used on Allegros (used for 1500/1750 starter motor solenoid, S1& 2 radiator fan, S3 heated rear window)?

2. The two wires going the the two side connectors of the relay are for Earth and power from the switch/headlamps - does it matter which way round these two wires connect to the relay?

3. Should the front foglamps be able to be switched on with just sidelamps? The rear foglamps only work with headlamps.

4. How does the front foglamp electrical system work?
I don't really know how/what the relay does it's stuff, but there seems to be power coming from the headlamp position of the main lighting switch which joins with power from the sidelamps position of that same switch when the front front fogs switch is one. The two sources of power seem to come together on one wire going to the relay, which I really don't understand.
Also there is a separate power to the relay from the battery, and a separate earth. I'm lost!

Any answers greatly appreciated!
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Hell has frozen over...... the car formally known as 'Heap' is back on the road!

[Andrew Mallett]

Hi Colin,
Hope you can make sense of this.
There should be a brown (live) wire with a connector on it coming out of the relay connector at the top position. I just put a piece of white insulating tape there to show it. This connects to the brown wire coming out of the end of the loom.
The black (earth) wire at the right earths where the relay connector bracket is screwed to the car.
The grey sleeved wire at the bottom runs along the bottom of the inner front panel with the two foglight live feed connectors on the end.
The blue (neutral) wire to the left connects to the blue wire coming out of the end of the loom.
Incidentally my front and rear foglights work when the sidelights are turned on.
My actual foglights are earthed where the two brackets on the front spoiler halves are screwed to the front panel.
I know I've told you this before but I thought I'd just say it again with pictures. Hope this helps.




The relay is screwed to the car with the relay connector bracket at the bottom.


This shows where it is screwed to the car.

[Andrew Mallett]

Two pictures of the foglight switch loom extension.
As you can see there are two red/green wires coming out of the clear loom extension connector. One goes to the left hand spade connector on the foglight switch. (looking at it from the front) The black earth wire goes to the right hand spade connector on the foglight switch. Not sure if it matters which way round the red/green and the black earth wires are connected to the switch spade connectors though.
Good luck Colin.

[Colin T]

Andrew, you are an absolute star, those pictures help me greatly, many many thanks.

Here is what I had made up from spare bits of wiring connectors etc:

Close to what the actual bits look like. I made this based on the information you previously provided and the existing connections in the wiring loom.

The relay is the same as the standard Allegro relay used elsewhere. This is good news as I don't have to find a different relay, I can use the spare one that I already have.

I had got the wires going to the relay mixed over left and right and up and down. The way I had them did work, but I wasn't sure it was right. I have now put them in the correct positions.

I have bullet connectors on the ends of the actual foglamp wires, which is why I have a double bullet connector at the end of the wire going from the relay to the foglamp wires. Looks like the S3 used the standard S3 thin pin connector, rather than the thicker bullet connector which I have. I think my foglamps are from a S1/2.

I have earthed my foglamp wires further up on the crossmember, like the earlier cars, as you had suggested previously, and like my Equipe. The wire ends should be better protected from the weather by being further up.

Interestingly, you have two metal brackets, one for the connector and one for the relay, but only the connector is screwed down. Bizzare. My relay connector cannot hold a metal bracket so I'll have the relay metal bracket holding the whole lot in.

My switch wiring loom has longer wires going to the illumination lamp spade connectors so that I can connect them to my manual radiator fan switch if I have that fitted instead of the front foglamp switch (that will only happen when my thermostatic switch has died, I've had 2 failures of that hence I've made an emergency manual fan switch loom, which I'll post about soon). I don't think it matters which way the illumination lamp wires go, I've mixed these up on other switches before.

I'm confused that your rear fogs work with just the sidelamps on. Mine only work with headlamps on, and I looked at the wiring diagram in Haynes and it made perfect sense to me why that happens, and it looks like it was designed to do that.

When I trial-fitted my front foglamp wiring, the lights came on (despite being wiring wrongly to the relay) with the sidelamps on. The rear fogs still only come on with the headlamps on too.

Many thanks again Andrew for your photos.
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Hell has frozen over...... the car formally known as 'Heap' is back on the road!

[Colin T]

Just a thought - can anybody else confirm when their foglamps (front or rear) can turned on, i.e. with sidelamps or headlamps or only with sidelamps?
_________________
Hell has frozen over...... the car formally known as 'Heap' is back on the road!

[Andrew Mallett]

Colin,

That's a bloody brilliant job, well done. Can't believe my descriptions all those months ago were good enough for you to come up with those fittings.

I think my rear foglight switch has been tampered with in the past so perhaps its wrong and should only come on with the headlights. I need to check my wiring out. Might need your help on that score.

PS. Regarding the rear Equipe foglight it would be nice to see a close up picture of the bracket so I could make two up for mine. Also a close up of the foglight itself front and rear. Thanks for the picture you did post though.

[Colin T]

Thanks for the compliment - it wasn't too difficult to make the wiring up, it's working out what wire goes where is the difficult bit!

I'll take some close ups of the rear fog next time I'm down south - my Equipe bits are at my dad's house over 200 miles away, which is why progress is slow with that car! Should be able to forward some pics to you in mid-November.
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Hell has frozen over...... the car formally known as 'Heap' is back on the road!

[Richard Howe]

Legally you're allowed to illuminate the fog lamps with only sidelights active, especially because if you're using front fogs then your headlights are likely to cause scatter and make it harder to see - that's why fogs were designed

That doesn't mean that all manufacturers follow this logic; I know my Shitroen only permits the rear foglights to be used with the headlights, not just the sidelights. The new Merc, Gonzo, and the Rover all allow fogs with sidelights. (Warren doesn't have any!)
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...that's why Allegro will look as good 5 years from now as it does today.

[Colin T]

[Richard Howe]

Yes, Gonzo's definitely a 3 facelift, registered June '82. It's quite possible the wiring was changed, fogs had only been a legal requirement for a short time so some adaptation to the law and the cars makes sense.

One thing I was surprised to learn recently was that for German cars, until recently the law required only one rear fog - but just that one; a pair was illegal! That explains why so many continental cars look like they should have a pair but only one side works...
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...that's why Allegro will look as good 5 years from now as it does today.

[Colin T]

[Andrew Mallett]

I wonder why my rear fogs don't work with sidelights but the front do.

[Richard Howe]

Perhaps the wiring's been muddled previously, or maybe they're Friday cars built by Scab sparks
_________________
...that's why Allegro will look as good 5 years from now as it does today.

[Andrew Mallett]

Scab sparks, ha ha, like it.